Hit the Breaks for More Speed

[00:00:00] Speaker A: I pretty much swing the golf club in an infinite state of acceleration. Swing as hard as you can for as long as you can until your body can't move anymore, and then it has to stop. And I don't think that that's correct. At least. You don't think it's correct. [00:00:20] Speaker B: One man's opinion. [00:00:27] Speaker A: I mean, you never know. Like, sometimes. I mean, that could have been on purpose. I didn't know if that was what you were going for with your hair or not. I mean, it still beats mine. [00:00:35] Speaker C: Yeah. I mean, it's not that bad. It's just got little squigglies over here. This is pretty much how it normally is, but it's getting too bad. [00:00:42] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:00:42] Speaker C: I used to have a buzz, and now it's long and gangly. Yeah. I guess we could start talking off with that golf tournament. That was fun. So this was the PGA University Championship. So 17 schools are competing. You send a roster of five, and the best four scores each day count, you know, so this is the third one I think I've got to go to. First one was in Las Vegas. Second one was in Mid Pines and Pinehurst last year. And then this one was in just north of Atlanta, Georgia, at a Pete Dye course, I think it was. Pete Dye course. That course was diabolical. Like, it was in. The rating was a 76 from the team boxes they played it from. Yeah, it was hard. Hard. And we get there Monday, or we get there Sunday night, and then Monday is our practice round, and the feels like is 17 degrees. It started snowing. Yeah, it started snowing at two different points during the practice round. And then round one wasn't much better. The only thing missing was the snow, but it was still extremely cold. But I was like, I'm gonna be out there with y', all, you know, following you around and giving you advice and taking videos and everything. And, I mean, that's. That's a level of cold. There's just not enough layers when all you're doing is sitting in a golf cart or swinging a club once every five minutes. It was miserable. [00:01:58] Speaker A: I'm a little surprised they played it. [00:01:59] Speaker C: Oh, yeah. [00:02:00] Speaker A: Like, I mean, that's. That's borderline unplayable. [00:02:02] Speaker C: Yeah, the. The. Everything, the fairways, everything was, like, rock hard. They didn't move the pins from practice round to day one because the greens were frozen. They literally couldn't replace the cups and, you know, get new ones. But it was a lot of fun. [00:02:17] Speaker A: The kids, if the ground is frozen, that's a good sign. [00:02:20] Speaker C: Good Sign we shouldn't be playing golf. Yeah. [00:02:22] Speaker A: Yeah. Isn't that a pretty good. Good, Good signal that we shouldn't be playing? [00:02:26] Speaker C: You'd think, but, I mean, they played even. [00:02:27] Speaker A: I follow that rule. [00:02:28] Speaker C: Yeah, they played fine. We just had way too many doubles and others. I had one kid made a 10. Our best player made a 10 on a par 5. [00:02:35] Speaker A: You might have made a 9, but you can't make a 10. [00:02:38] Speaker C: Well, technically, this is the thing. And then we had some crazy stuff with scoring. Technically, he made a nine, but he for. Didn't realize he miscounted and wrote down a 10. So that's what he got. And then we had. [00:02:47] Speaker A: That's a rough hole when you miscount. Yeah, that's really bad. [00:02:51] Speaker C: Yeah. And then we had another situation where this. One of our players signed his scorecard. They told him what the score added up to. He said, yes. They said, okay, you're good. Twenty minutes later, one of the other players goes, hey, I thought you shot 76. They've got you down for 77. He's like, I shot 76. Someone had changed it, and it was outside of 15 minutes, so they wouldn't adjust it. I'm like, you gotta be kidding. [00:03:13] Speaker A: I didn't even know that there was. I didn't. I thought that once you signed it, it was official. I didn't know you had 15 minutes. [00:03:17] Speaker C: You know, what are you gonna do? Uh, I had two other weird rulings. Same kid, two different coaches from two different other teams called a rules official over. One of them said he marked his golf ball incorrectly, which he didn't. And the rules of Fish. I was sitting there with the rules official, and the rules official was like, well, I mean, I need to know exactly where you place that golf ball in relation to this coin. And I was like. I was looking at the guy. I was like, show me that you can place the golf ball exactly the same place, not a millimeter forward or back. You know, like, what are we talking about here? And he's like, because technically, if you didn't do it exactly the same, that's a penalty. And I'm like, how would you even know if he didn't do it the right. You know, the same way twice. Like, show me put a coin down, put a ball and measure it with some type of device, and show me it's perfect every single time, you know? And then another situation. He hit a ball into some thick stuff. He finds it. And another coach comes over and is like, are you sure that's your ball? And he was like, yeah. He's like, why don't you go ahead and identify it? Pick it up and identify it. He picks it up, identifies it. It's his ball. Puts it back. Exactly. Like, he didn't take it all. It's just like real quick, you know, small. And then the. The coach goes over and tells the rules official that he didn't mark it before he picked it up. So they gave him a penalty for that. I'm like, he's like, the coach told me to pick it up. He didn't tell me to mark it and then pick it up. He just said, pick it up. So I just did what he told me to do. So that was unfortunate as well. But so. [00:04:39] Speaker A: So this was like, coach. [00:04:40] Speaker C: A coach for another team. Yeah. Another university team. Yeah. [00:04:44] Speaker A: I mean, isn't that like an. Is it. Is that entrapment? Is there an entrance in golf? [00:04:49] Speaker C: But anyway, they played. They played hard, they fought hard. But so here, I'll say, here are my big takeaways. 1. Playing golf in extremely cold weather is insanely difficult because, like, you can't hardly move. You're so layered up. Right. I mean, it's. And you couldn't have paid me money to play golf with them those, those few days. Usually I'm pretty envious of the courses they get to play in these tournaments and the competition, but I was like, nah, I'm good. I'll just. I'll just watch, you know? [00:05:10] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:05:11] Speaker C: I did hit one hole or one shot on the 17th hole as we were driving in from the practice round. It was like an island type green and the wind was blowing so hard and it was so cold. They said, it's 132 yards. I said, someone give me a seven iron. I just took a seven iron. I hit the green. But it was, it was definitely tough. Tough course, but. So obviously, you know, there's a reason why golf is a quote unquote, spring through fall sport is because it's not like football or soccer where you're running the whole time and your blood's flowing. You literally, unless you're walking. But even then, if you're walking, you're exposed to the cold wind. So it's not much better. But it's really, really tough. Trying to be prepared is really tough. That's why the PGA Tour starts off in the south and then moves their way to the north. Right. Because of the temperatures. And then two really, really good players. Really, really good golfers. Tournament golf is hard. It's just hard. Like, I was Talking to some of the parents about some of these kids that were playing, they're like, oh, yeah, he's ranked such and such in our state. And oh, yeah, he's won this tournament and that tournament. And then I see the kid making nine on a hole, you know, just because tough golf is tough golf and tournament golf is tournament golf. And it's. It's just really, really challenging sport to. To play well at. [00:06:15] Speaker B: You were in Georgia, right? [00:06:16] Speaker C: Yeah, it was snowing an hour north of Atlanta. Georgia, isn't that. [00:06:21] Speaker B: I thought that was still the South. [00:06:22] Speaker C: I know, it was crazy. [00:06:24] Speaker A: It's crazy. If you're an hour north of Atlanta, though, that's going to be getting into the mountains a little bit. [00:06:29] Speaker C: It wasn't too mountain. It was Milton, Georgia. So it wasn't too bad. No. And an hour, and it was 45 minutes north, you know, with traffic, so it wasn't that far north. But still, the. The thing I was gonna say was we literally missed perfect weather on either window by like three days. The three days we were there were the coldest days. Aside from that, it was like 60 degrees and sunny, you know, so, like, it just couldn't. Wow. Yeah. Same thing happened to us and we went to Las Vegas and Nevada. It was the same type of deal. Everyone shows up with three quarter zips and polos and it was freezing cold, so. But yeah, anyway, it was a lot of fun. I was proud of my kids. Had a lot of fun with them, you know, and it's always just fun when you get to see them try their best and, you know, sometimes they do great, sometimes they don't. But try your best. Forget the rest, you know, that's all we can do. [00:07:13] Speaker A: Yeah, that'd be a good topic to maybe get into. First of all, full caveat on that. Like, I. I tend to follow the. The guidelines of the. My first real teacher in high school, he had a real simple. He called it the. The 50 degree rule. After November 1st, if it's below 50, 50 degrees or the wind's blowing more than 10 miles an hour, I'm not playing golf. And I tend to follow that. Some people don't. And if you don't, then first of all, God bless you. But second of all, it's a different animal. And 50 degrees is. Correct me if I'm wrong on this, Tony. I. At one point, when I was in college, I was working at a golf course, and the pro there gave me the PGA textbook, basically. And for a long time, I still had, I don't know, where it's at, but it has in there a chart basically of golf ball carry distances based on temperature. Now since then I've not been able to find the book and I can't find the chart online. And anytime I google it, it says 2 yards of carry distance per 10 degrees of temperature. Okay. But the chart that, I don't remember exactly what it was, but it was quite a bit different in the PGA book because. And it wasn't linear. It was like you got below 50 and it exponentially drops off. But I know that there's more to it than just air temperature. There's air temperature, ball temperature, your muscles. [00:08:30] Speaker C: There's a lot of things I don't, I don't know. I haven't looked that up or seen any studies that have measured that recently. But I know my golf spy or someone else did something where they put golf balls in like refrigerators. So like the equivalent of leaving golf ball in your trunk overnight, you know, like, and it's freezing overnight. And they showed the difference in ball speed and carry with that versus like a room temperature ball versus a hot ball. So I mean there's. Yeah, all you can do is, I. [00:08:54] Speaker A: Mean not in competition, but when I would, when I was playing a little bit in the, in the wintertime, I would put hand warmers in my pocket and I would keep that thing on the golf ball. [00:09:02] Speaker B: Yep. [00:09:03] Speaker C: Ben Hogan did the same. [00:09:04] Speaker A: I know that the air temperature probably doesn't make. Air temperature wise, it may be to 2 yards per 10 degrees. But when you start layering all these things on top of each other, the golf ball elasticity is a big deal. Then the player's elasticity is going to be another thing. Then when you start throwing 17 layers of clothes on top of it. I mean I've had the same thing as you. Like, you know, wintertime, I'm getting 7 iron 138 and leaving it short. And it's like what in the world? But that's why you just, just don't play in the winter. Would be my or, or shout out to Solly's, go find you a nice indoor simulator. [00:09:39] Speaker C: Yeah. Or just accept that it's going to be different and play a different game. [00:09:43] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. I mean I've, I've got buddies that live in Chicago and they play. As long as they can get outside, they will play. I mean hang sports in the wintertime. Baseball is a spring sport. I transferred and played baseball in Minnesota for four years. My first game, my first year there was. I played in snow flurries and the game just kept going. I'm from Texas, I'm like, does anyone see snow flurries? Like we're not supposed to play, we're. [00:10:12] Speaker A: Supposed to go home. [00:10:14] Speaker C: Yeah, no, I, I actually like playing in the winter whenever it's decent. Like if it's 40 degrees, I'll play. If it gets down to 30s, I'm not playing. But like, if it's in the 40s, high 40s, you know, I'll play. Me and my buddy usually just bundle up and walk. So you try to stay as loose muscles as loose as possible. You're still gonna be cold, but at least you're not just sitting in a frozen. And I just like it because there's hardly anybody out there typically. So you can go play and work on stuff and have fun that way, you know. [00:10:38] Speaker A: How much more important would you guys say it is on those days to. It's always important to make sure you're loose and warmed up and everything. But how much more important is it in the winter time if you're going to try to play when it's below X degrees to make sure you're properly stretched out, make sure you've got the blood flowing a little bit. I know how I feel when I first wake up in the morning. It's 25 degrees. I don't feel like I can hardly move. I would imagine you got to do a lot more to loosen your body up in those colder temperatures and stay loose as you're playing. [00:11:03] Speaker B: I've got a couple clients in the wintertime, they use a heated vest. It's got like, it's. It literally has a button they click and they have settings on it to at least keep their core warm. I got guys that sit in a hot tub before they go play. I know for me with my low back stuff, the worst thing for me is I sweat really easily. And so I, you know, I'm trying to warm up, work up a lather, whatever it is I'm doing outside. The next thing I know I start sweating and then it get. The wind starts blowing and then I'm just like freezing cold. [00:11:35] Speaker C: I was at Costco and I almost bought a battery powered heated vest for this just for this trip alone. I was thinking just for like, you know, when I play golf in the winter and I'm gonna get one eventually. But the reviews on the one I saw were not very good. They were like, it's just not, it's not a good basket. But yeah, no, absolutely. There was a sauna in the clubhouse at the Golf course. We played this tournament and my kids were like, should we go get in the sauna? And like, just like, team huddle in the sauna. I was like, that's all fine and good, but as soon as you get back outside, it's gonna be freaking cold again. So it doesn't matter. But no, yeah, it's. Think about your muscles right as like putty, play. Doh, clay, whatever. If it stays loose and warm, it's more pliable. You put it in the freezer and then tell it, go stretch. It's just like you. I'm not doing it. So you have to do a lot of beliefing out there. Sorry, I apologize on that. [00:12:21] Speaker A: That'll be fun. Tony just wants to get more of those 175 mile an hour ball speeds on the recording. He's not satisfied with just the beginning and the end. [00:12:28] Speaker C: It's not just the one. Yeah, I got to get a lot of them in there. But no, yeah, definitely winter golf. I mean there's. Yeah, there's a reason why it's a spring, summer, fall sport. [00:12:38] Speaker A: Yeah. Well, hey, I haven't said welcome to the best golf podcast ever yet. If you've stuck around for the first 13 minutes or ever, how long this ends up being. Thank you for your patience. This is the best golf podcast ever. So welcome and I hope you enjoy yourselves here. This is Mike Hendricks. Michael. Why do you say Michael when you enter? [00:12:57] Speaker B: You know, my mom and my ex wife are the only ones that call. [00:13:01] Speaker A: Me Michael and the governor, I just changed it. Now you're Mike. Okay, so Mike, Mike, Tony. I always see Michael for some reason, I'm like, what in the world? So, Mike Hendricks, certified TPI personal trainer for. I don't. Do you work with anybody that's not golfers? Is it just golfers? [00:13:18] Speaker B: I'd say it's probably 90% guys that golf, you know, but that's all over the map, right? You know, guys that play once a week to guys that play five times a week, so. [00:13:30] Speaker A: And Tony Rosselli, PGA teacher for. I was actually talking to somebody about you today at Sully's. You met him, I guess, when we were doing the two man guy's name's Chris. But anyway, he, I guess is. I. I can't begin to describe what I. I can't even pronounce the name of your degree. Kinesiology. I don't know if it is a kinesiology, whatever it is. Biomechanics, something. But he was saying he does the same thing. So he was saying, is he the body guy. I said, well, Mike's the TPI guy, but Tony's a, like a hybrid here, right? Because you've. You've got the body background, but you're also a PGA teaching pro, so. And then I'm. I'm Garrett. I just. Just do the podcast and try to listen to these guys. Speaking of, though, I want to give you both a big shout out. Start with you, Mike, because it's funny. We talked about this a little bit on the last podcast. We did. I. I listen to you guys. I very seldom actually do what you say you should do, which is really stupid. So as I was when we're recording these videos, I'm not paying that close of attention, probably. I'm mostly focused on, like, where's the camera? And are we in? You know, we're getting a good shot. Whatever. It's when I go back and edit and release the videos, I'm like, oh, yeah, I've been tightening my hips. And this entire part of the video was about how to loosen your hips up. So after I released that video, I started following some of Mike's wisdom and foam rolling my hips out a couple times a day and doing some of those stretches that we did. And I'm not. I know I text you about this earlier in the week, but I don't know, I probably. I would probably foam roll 2 to 3 minutes each hip a couple times a day. Maybe once in the morning, once in the evening. No science to this at all. Just once in a while, I'd walk past it and think, oh, I haven't done that. You know, I'll roll it out a little bit. Did some. Some of the stretches maybe once a day. And for the first couple of days, didn't really notice that much of a difference. It just, you know, I was just like, well, you know, I'll. I'll keep doing it, eventually get better. It was like a sudden. It was. It came in burst. It was like a couple days later, I started to notice, hey, the right hip doesn't really hurt that bad. In fact, the left one's worse than the right now. So I started putting some more energy on that. And then a couple days after that, I. I just realized it don't hurt anymore at all. Like, there was no tightness I could. It was. It was crazy. It was probably a week total, but it's. It doesn't take that much. It wasn't like I was spending an hour a day doing this stuff. It was just a couple, you know, probably 15, 20 minutes total on all of it. And it has made a gigantic difference. [00:15:59] Speaker C: It's a quick roi. [00:16:01] Speaker A: I mean, seriously, it felt like you were stabbing me in the hip with a, with a knife a couple weeks ago. And now it's like I feel, I feel fantastic. Now I have noticed that my quads are tight, so I got to keep moving my way down, I guess to some other areas. [00:16:15] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:16:15] Speaker A: And, and I was going to bring this up last time, but we, we kind of blamed my lack of balance on ankle mobility. But wouldn't the hip also play a fact? Because now I can close my eyes and do that balance drill. I think I, the other night I did it for 25 seconds on the right and 30 seconds on the left with my eyes closed. So I feel like that's made a huge difference. Wouldn't your hip play into your balance a little bit also? Or could it? [00:16:39] Speaker B: Well, absolutely. You got like, Tony, I were saying, you know, the kinetic chain, your hips a mobile joint and your ankles a mobile joint. And you know, if you've got some stiffness in those mobile joints and getting them activated, just the foam rolling them, get them activated and you're starting to and balance. So when I tell people like fitness is like a three legged stool, right? You've got balance, strength, flexibility. Well, the, the balance comes the quickest. So it's not surprising. I see the balance piece come the quickest. The strength piece, it comes, you know, after a month or two. And then the flexibility piece is like, it's just constantly got to work on it. People are, you know, people that are stiff for a long time, it takes a lot of work. So I'm encouraged that you're doing it. I use the term prehab. Right. So now you've kind of unlocked your body a little bit and what happens. There's people that I deal with, older adults, a lot of times they're in and out of physical therapy and then they feel great. I feel like a new person. And then they stop doing their exercises that their physical therapist sent them home with. And then they're like, oh, I gotta do those again, I gotta do those again. And I try to encourage them. Like those are prehab. You don't want to wait until you're broken down. So I love that you're doing the foam rolling, like make that part of your daily routine. Because then if you wait until my hips are feeling tight again or you know, your back goes out, then you have to take a step back for a couple weeks and get start to feel better again. So Anyway, I love it. Keep doing it, and I'll take. I'll take any of the credit you want to give me, so. [00:18:24] Speaker A: Well, you get all the credit because you're the one telling me what to do. I just did it a little bit. It was. But I was just. I was blown away at how quick, because I think when I tried. When I first bought that foam roller. First of all, my foam roller is a. Is a cylinder brick. It is hard as a rock, and it hurts like crazy. So when I first bought it a few, you know, several months ago, I tried to foam roll it a little bit, and I noticed real quick that my hips were by far the most pain. In fact, it was so painful that I was wondering, is this not a safe place to roll? Maybe you're not supposed to do that. Yeah, maybe you're not supposed to do this. So I never did it because it was just like, this hurts. This is like, this isn't worth it. I'd rather. I. I. As much as I want to hit the ball a long way, I would take. I would give you 20 yards off my driving distance to not have to. [00:19:09] Speaker C: You wouldn't. [00:19:10] Speaker B: No, you would. [00:19:11] Speaker A: You're right. [00:19:12] Speaker B: You're right. [00:19:15] Speaker A: But I was really surprised at how quickly. And I guess I have a question for. For other golfers that might listen to this. It was my experience with that. Is that to be expected? Because to me, I'm thinking, okay, if I foam roll today, tomorrow I should feel a little better, and the next day, I should feel a little better. The next day, I should feel a little better. I'll be honest with you. The first couple times I did it, I hurt worse the next day or two. And then it was just like, suddenly one day there was a huge jump, and then it stayed about the same for a few more days, and then suddenly it was just once in a while. This is the oddest thing. We're talking about my pelvis. When you got on here, Mike, so, you know. [00:19:55] Speaker C: Garrett was talking about his pelvis. There's no way I was a bystander. [00:20:03] Speaker A: You were listening, which makes you a participant. [00:20:05] Speaker C: All right. [00:20:05] Speaker A: We were talking about. But sometimes, I mean, just the way I'm just weird when I was tighten my hips once in a while, as I'm just going through my day, I would just, like, touch my hip bone and see, like, does it still hurt? And it was like one day I touched was like, oh, it doesn't hurt anymore. So then I got on the phone roll that night. I was like, even on the Phone roller. It doesn't hurt. So I was just surprised at how quickly. If I had known how quickly you could work that tightness out, I probably would have stuck with it back in April or whatever it was. But when I did it for the first two or three days and it was still hurting, I was like, this isn't working and I'm not sticking with it. So is that normal that you're going to go a few days maybe without seeing any change at all and then it just suddenly feel a little bit better, or is that just weird? [00:20:46] Speaker B: Oh, that's the million dollar question. Everybody's body responds differently. That's why there's no, there's no one magic pill there. You know, if it was just stretching alone, if it was just soft tissue work, if it was just acupuncture, you know, I've been doing this for 20 years and I run into all types of therapy people and they have mixed results. Right. Everybody responds differently. But you know, that's what we have in the gym. Right? That's all I got. We've got things to work on, the tissue to try to soften it up. We've got some mobility exercises. You know, I don't have a massage therapist on hand. So though you just got to use the tools we have at the gym. So no, I'm not surprised. But it. Everybody's different. I'll just say it like that. [00:21:32] Speaker A: I would kind of liken it to like trying to untangle a knot. You know, when you're first trying to untangle a knot, it's like pulling teeth to get one strand freed up. But then once you start to unwind it a little bit, it's like it starts to unravel really quickly. And it's kind of like that. It was like once it finally started to. That tightness started to break up a little bit, it started to, to move along pretty quick and it just, I feel a whole lot looser. And now I said I was going to give you both a shout out. I mean, to Tony. Tony has finally, almost successfully talked me into not swinging max speed 24 7. And I congratulate you for that. Maybe your biggest professional accomplishments. Finally, almost. Sometimes. [00:22:13] Speaker C: Sometimes every time. [00:22:16] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:22:17] Speaker A: But we were talking the other day and I think this is a good topic to dive into a little bit. But I pretty much swing the golf club in an infinite state of acceleration. Swing as hard as you can for as long as you can until your body can't move anymore and then it has to stop. And I don't Think that that's correct at least you don't think it's correct. [00:22:41] Speaker B: One man's opinion. [00:22:42] Speaker A: But he. Well, that's your. That's your opinion. I suppose it's. You're entitled to it. But I just started to. To listen to you a little bit and say, okay, what if I did slow down a little bit and let some of these sequencing things happen? I know I sent you that one video, but it was like a few months ago. I topped out at I think 99 with an eight iron, clubhead speed with an eight iron. And I could carry. I think my high end carry was like 178. [00:23:09] Speaker C: Cool. Why. [00:23:14] Speaker A: I was very proud of that because it's. It's cooler to hit a full maxed out eight iron 178 than a three quarter seven iron 178. Yeah, that's right. But the other day, Tony kind of challenged me, like, just. Just hit some balls like without going max speed. Like, we've got to slow you down and get you out of max speed all the time. So I was like, okay, whatever. He don't know what the hell he's talking about. But just, I'll humor him just to. [00:23:40] Speaker B: Get him off my back. [00:23:42] Speaker A: I'm going to hit a couple of soft three quarter eight irons. Like I'm, you know, holding an egg in my hand or whatever you want to call it. And when it carries 147, I'll send him back the statistical evidence that this doesn't work. And I hit a couple of little soft eight irons, kind of like I'm trying to hit like a little 75 yard lob wedge. Nothing crazy, just a little smooth one. And I'll be damned. The thing carried 172 yards and it didn't move the balls in a row. Didn't move an inch. 3. All three of those balls that I sent you on the video, I think two of them in particular, I think landed about 8 inches apart. They were the exact same shot, the exact same curvature, the exact same height, same spin rate, launch angle. Everything was identical. And I was like, huh, Tony might be onto something here. So between Mike loosening up my pelvic muscles and getting me to a point where I can actually move like a respectable human being, and Tony teaching me to live within my boundaries, y' all might actually know what you're talking about. [00:24:40] Speaker C: Well, I mean, like, look like, let's look at it this way. Okay If I put you on, you know, TPC Sawgrass, the infamous island green. And I said, hey, man, you got to hit this green, you know, And I give you the club that will. If you hit it as hard as you can and just perfectly, it will reach the center of the green. But that's the one I want or the one. It'll just cover the front pin. It'll get four yards on the green. I'm like, here, you can do this one, or you can use this club that we know. If you hit it. If you hit it bad, it's going to cover the front. If you hit it good, it's going to get all the way to the back, but no farther. Which one are you gonna. If a million dollars is on the line, what is the play? You know, like, it's just obviously the. [00:25:21] Speaker A: First one every time. [00:25:22] Speaker C: No, no, no, no, no. Tin cup right here in the flesh. [00:25:27] Speaker B: I think Garrett takes the CrossFit approach to golf. As many as you can, as fast as you can, do it over and over again. So we just got to get you out of CrossFit mentality. [00:25:40] Speaker C: Yeah, I had to. I had a shot with one of my students, you know, one of my players. Yesterday, I guess it was yesterday. We get to the 8, 8th hole, and it's a tough hole. It's like a hard dog leg, right? And there's a bunker straight through the fairway, so you have to lay short of that. We have to really cut it around the corner. Anyway. He hits a really good kind of peely cut around the corner, small cut around the corner. He's got 170 yards. It's slightly downwind, but the green is not very deep. And there's bunker in front of the flag and crap. Long. You don't want to go long. So I'm talking to him. I'm like, do you think. You think you can get eight iron there with the wind down when he goes? Yeah, he goes. But I'd have to hit it pretty much perfect. Or nine iron, something like that. Whatever it was, the number doesn't matter. And I was like, okay, cool. I was like, well, let's aim five yards right of the flag just in case it doesn't go perfect. You're not in that bunker. He goes, yeah, he goes. He goes. But I think. I think I should hit the seven. I think I should hit a seven or eight or whatever the next club up was. And I was like, I think that's a good idea. You know, like, let's hedge our bets here a little bit. Sure enough, he hits a toe ball, a pole, but it covers the bunker, and he's got a simple chip on and a par. Had he tried to hit that exact same shot with the club less, he would have been plugged in the bunker, right? It would have been terrible. And I said, that's why we choose the right club, right? And he. And the right target. He goes, yes, sir. That's why we do that. Because he got away with a 60% shot and still easy par. Well. [00:27:08] Speaker A: And I can't remember if I told the story on the podcast or not, but I had the similar experience a few weeks, a few, I don't know, a month or two ago. I can't remember if this was the Ryder Cup. It was a. It was an important round. Whatever it was mattered, whether it was a league round or whatever. And I can't remember the exact number, but I think I was something like 206 maybe. And I'm thinking, I want to hit five iron. It was, it was 206 to a front pin, call it. And it's like, okay, that's right at my flushed five iron number. And I don't want to hit this to the middle of the green because I want to make eagle. Because that's what we do. We try to hit it as close as possible. And I'm going to hit five iron. I'm going to flush it, and I'm going to make eagle. And as I'm standing over and I'm just like, Tony, I'm pretty sure would tell me not to hit. [00:27:56] Speaker C: Don't do this. [00:27:59] Speaker A: Because how many times out of 10 Do I flush a 5 iron if I'm being honest about. [00:28:03] Speaker B: Well, that was going to be my next question. [00:28:05] Speaker A: Very many. [00:28:06] Speaker B: Well, when's the last time you had any? [00:28:07] Speaker A: He's not very many. I don't know. Anyway, that's not the qu. That's not. [00:28:15] Speaker B: Okay, Sorry. [00:28:16] Speaker A: We don't. We don't ask hard questions on this show. This is a layup show. I can remember the last time I tried to make an eagle. Does that count? [00:28:22] Speaker B: Yes. Sure. [00:28:23] Speaker A: Okay. But at the last minute, I was like, you know what? I'm just going to hit four iron in case I don't flush this. And I hit a little toe ball to six feet. And it was the coolest thing. It was like, oh, that's so cool. Because, yeah, if I flush it, I'm going to have a 30 footer, but there's worse things in the world. But if I do happen to miss this ball a little bit, then. And it worked out perfect, I hit it right in the circle. So, yeah, there's there's something to it. I'm trying to. To stick to that. But let's dive into that just a touch, Tony, because there was something that you. We. Me and you talked about this on the poem. I don't know that I'm the only golfer that. That didn't realize this. Acceleration is important at certain stages of the golf swing. You got to get the thing moving. But I think golfers underestimate how important deceleration is to creating power. Because we just think, go as fast. [00:29:19] Speaker C: As fast. [00:29:19] Speaker A: As fast as you can. Right. Well, the analogy me and you were talking about on the phone is like, I can get in your Corvette with you, and you can accelerate me from 0 to 150 miles an hour over the course of. I don't ever how many seconds it takes to do that. And I'll probably get some G forces, you know, running through me. But a top fuel Dragster generates about three GS, I believe, and that's going from zero to 300 and a quarter mile in four seconds or whatever it is. But if you're riding along in your car at 30 miles an hour and you hit a brick wall, you're going to experience like 25. [00:29:51] Speaker C: That's right. [00:29:51] Speaker A: Right. You're going to get a lot more. So it's the deceleration that really, if you're just constantly accelerating and you're never experiencing the deceleration, you're not getting the power released properly. So that's something. You said that. Or you didn't say it exactly that way, but I think the word you used was load it, shift your weight, and then everything from that point forwards, kind of bracing for impact. And I was like, brace for impact? No, you. You swing your ass off through impact. You don't brace for anything. Why would I. Why would I brace? That sounds like I'm slowing down, but the more I try to feel that you get that effortless pop that everybody. Everybody wants effortless power. Right. That's where it kind of comes from, is letting it out. And I'm. But for me, I will say I'm still struggling with it because that is such a. It's a timing thing for me. I can't. I got to get comfortable with that concept because whenever I try to brace, I just, like, stop everything. And, you know, there's. There's not much of a release, so. But I think it is an important thing that I bet a lot of golfers don't think about how important decelerating certain parts of the body are. [00:30:57] Speaker C: Yeah, well, so again, it gets back to parametric acceleration. It gets back to. [00:31:01] Speaker A: Comes back to what? [00:31:04] Speaker C: Sorry. So let me back it up. I don't have a golf club in Harris Day backing up parametric acceleration. Okay, okay, so here we go. We got the golf club. [00:31:18] Speaker A: It's with your hair. I just want to say. I just want to. Right now. Yeah, that's right. With your hairstyle, saying words like parametric, decelerator, whatever that word was. You do have like the MAD document. Brilliant. [00:31:30] Speaker C: This is the thing I hate, okay? This is the thing that pisses me off. In all the comics, yeah, in all the comics, as PhDs are portrayed so horribly, we're always the villain, the evil doctor so and so. You know, I'm like, what's up with that? [00:31:43] Speaker A: It's messed up. [00:31:44] Speaker C: See? Anyway, okay, so here's your golf club, right? It hinges back. You know, we got the lag or whatever when it's coming down. Okay? This, this pulling up, this handle, slowing down and going up is what creates the acceleration. That's that release we talked about in the lag, right? So you can take this with anything. You feel it, you pull up and it goes really fast. If I pull, it's not releasing. If I just pull forward, it's not releasing. If I rotate, it's not. Now the golf club is swung on an angle, an incline plane. So that pull up is happening on that angle. So it's coming down, and then, whoosh, it goes up that way, around the corner, right around left. So that's what we're talking about there. But you don't get that by continuing to rotate your body. I mean, how fast can you turn your trunk? How fast can you move your arms? Not very fast. So how are we getting the speed? It has to release. It has to come out somewhere. The golfing machine talks about the golfer's flail. Well, flail is what they used to use to beat wheat. Like thresh wheat out, you know that. Like this. And basically it was two. It's like a nunchuck, basically, right? Two sticks with a piece of leather and they'd. Well, how do you pop a towel? You pull it back, right? You slow it down. So that's how you get speed. [00:33:00] Speaker A: No, that's. That's an analogy I've heard before. It's the popping the towel. If you just keep throwing your arm as. As hard as you can pull a. [00:33:06] Speaker C: Towel, it's never gonna hop right. But if I go right and pull it back, same thing. Like I think about a slingshot okay. The slingshot. The rubber band accelerates and then it hits those two posts and it slows down. Right? The two posts slow it down. Think about the trebuchet, or think about that. That. That ride the fair where it's got that big counterweight on one side and the people are in a boat. It goes whoosh. Right, that. Right. That's what flings you. That's what throws you out. Think about lacrosse. Lacrosse players. They've got that thing, right, that. I don't know what you call it. I didn't play lacrosse. I'm not from the Northeast or Rich, so whatever. Sorry. To Oliver Klopp. Lacrosse players in the kid. This thing. A stick in a net, right. It's called a stick, but it doesn't take much. Like, you just give it to a kid and at first they're going to try to figure out how to throw it. It's not going to take them very long to realize. I accelerate the handle and then I decelerate the handle and that flings the ball out, right? Yeah, that's it. They're not just pulling it this way. You'll never throw the thing. Right. Yeah. So same with throwing a ball. The arm accelerates and then it slows down. That's when it flings out. It gets flung out. Right. So I think the golfers would do better to learn. Yes. How to brace, how to slow down so that the club can go out and generate speed. Absolutely. Absolutely. [00:34:21] Speaker A: Well, I know for me, that I had done enough. You know, I've looked at enough golf swings and watched enough athletic motion golf videos that I did understand that there was a deceleration that took place. I think in my mind, though, that was happening. That was supposed to happen much later in the swing than it really does. And there is a video, and I know you cringe probably every time I bring up athletic motion golf, because I know they're very, you know, very technical and they get into a lot of details. There was a video that I remember there was a video that they did a few months ago that I saw, or I saw it a few months ago. I don't know when it came out, but they talk about hand speed. And I gotta go on a little bit of a side road to get here. But they were saying that hand speed is one of the highest correlators to swing speed. And how quickly you reach that hand speed in the downswing is. Is another correlator. So for golfers who reach their max hand speed below delivery, they're not going to get as much club head speed as those who max out their hand speed at the top. So here's the flawed way that I looked at this. I heard this and said, okay, I need to speed my hands up faster. But there's another side of that, right? And that is that, okay, if they're maxing out their hand speed at, say, this position, then that means that the hands are slowing from here on. Now, kinematics or kinematic sequence? Kinematic sequence. [00:35:44] Speaker C: Kinematic. There you go. Kinematic. [00:35:46] Speaker A: Kinematic. We're educating him. [00:35:47] Speaker C: He's learning. [00:35:50] Speaker A: Two things that I think I know. Number one, in the kinematic sequence, hips lead the torso, which lead the arms, which lead the hands, which lead the club head. So in that order, the hands are going to be the last part of your body to reach their max speed. [00:36:06] Speaker B: Right. [00:36:06] Speaker A: But for them to start slowing down, the hips, torso, shoulders have already started slowing down. The other thing I believe is that if I understand levers and physics correctly, the further away you are from the center, the faster things move. So your hands are probably the fastest part of your body that's moving in the golf swing. [00:36:27] Speaker B: Correct. [00:36:28] Speaker A: So if the fastest part of my body reaches its max speed at about arm parallel on the way down, then that tells me, if I'm still accelerating my hips at club parallel on the way down, that I am not going to have a very good kinematic sequence. Is that correct? Because basically, once I get to about that position, my body is done accelerating and it's. It's all slowing down at that point. The club head is the only thing left to accelerate beyond about. And that happens so much because to me, I have tried to decelerate around impact, but that's not where the deceleration of your body starts. That's where the deceleration of the club head starts. But the body has started decelerating. Pretty much the entire downswing is deceleration for the body. [00:37:12] Speaker C: Yep. [00:37:13] Speaker A: And that is so bass ackwards to me, Right. Like, that makes no sense that I have to slow down to hit it farther. [00:37:19] Speaker C: Well, so I think it's true. The big. Yeah, so the big problem comes from golf commentary on tv. Look how hard they're firing the hips. Look how open they are at impact. And you get articles written in magazines or players discussing what they think they feel. We've talked about this before, like, players saying, this is what I. What I'm trying to do. Whatever. They all describe it differently and what makes sense to them. But, yeah, I Mean, Jack Nicklaus again, famously said, you cannot release the golf club too early. Well, that means he's not still actively accelerating all the way through the shot. Right. And I think he had some good success. So it has to be done properly, it has to be done in sequence. Right. And, but this is where the teaching, coaching gets to it, right? Just because you can understand a concept doesn't mean we can explain it in a way that makes sense for each individual person. Like some people, you say, don't accelerate from the top and they're just going to throw their hands and flip it from the top immediately, right? So that's where the individual one on one stuff, you have to make sure that the client or the student understands what you mean by that. That's where you and I can talk on the phone. You can send me a video and I can say, you're getting closer, right? This is your best one yet, whatever. But if someone takes this and they say, okay, I need to not accelerate, and they already have a terrible kinematic sequence. They don't have any kinematic sequence to begin with. Their backswing is literally just throw their hands at it from the start. Well, they don't have the foundational part to understand how to use that properly. That concept properly makes sense. [00:38:46] Speaker A: Well, and the, yeah, and the really cool thing about. And, and I'm a really good example of what you're saying there because the day we had that conversation on the phone, I came back here and, and went into the, to the clubhouse and hit a few balls and sent it. And dude, it was terrible. I mean, you saw the. I don't know if you could see how bad I hit it, but I made terrible contact. And it was a day or two after that that I sent you another video that was like, I think I'm starting to get it now. And you know, it's interesting. Like, we've all had those shots where, you know, you're, you're stock eight irons, 150 yards and you, you're 142 and you try to hit an easy eight iron and you hit it 160, right? To me, it's about that simple is what I'm getting at is that I really do have to slow down, especially the downswing, because you can, I don't know if you can swing the club back too fast, if you're doing it in the right sequence and do it. But once you make that transition, you've got to. It's one of the very first videos we did together over in the, the studio over there, the clubhouse was coil and release. And I could not believe how fast you were saying to release the tension because I'm just like, that won't work. But sure enough. [00:39:54] Speaker C: Well, again, how fast is the downswing? [00:39:56] Speaker A: 10Th, 10th of a second, I think. [00:39:58] Speaker C: Super fast, right? Just freaking fast. [00:40:01] Speaker A: It's nothing. And that's. But, but that's a, It's a good point because for me, even though it's only 2/10 of a second, it is warping my entire world because I have to feel like I stop halfway through the swing, even though it's only 2/10 of a second. Time wise, it's not half. But distance it is, but I just have to feel like I slow down so much sooner than I. I think I should. But at the same time, the positive to that is once you figure that out, the time that we're the most tense and the most anxious in our golf swing is the downswing. In the backswing, we're thinking we've got plenty of time to fix our problems, right? The downswings, when we're really trying to guide it, when you really accept this concept, by the time you make your transition, the swing's over. You've done all you can do. There's nothing to worry about at that point. [00:40:46] Speaker C: So you get it. Yeah. You set it and hope for the best after that. So I was a good example of understanding concepts. Right. I was working with a new client last week and you know, he's. He's. He works in painting. He's a, he's a general contractor. He does painting or he's a paint contractor as his own business. And he was super tight. His body was all locked up and shut off. And I said, by chance, do you sit a lot for work? He was like, well, no, I'm a paint contractor. I was like, well, are you like the boss? He was like, yeah, I sit in the truck a lot. You're right. And like his hips, no disassociation, couldn't control upper lower body. Took him through some TPI stuff, right? Like just a complete robot, super stiff. And so I was trying to get him to understand kinematic sequence, blah, blah, blah. And I was like, have you ever played any other sports before? He's like, nah, not really. And I was like, well, imagine you're throwing a frisbee left handed. Like you're gonna step and it's gonna coil back and then it's gonna uncoil in a sequence. He goes, oh, I play frisbee golf quite often. I was like, well, just do that. Like just do that. And so he just started working that. And he came into me saying, you know, he was a shanker. Like he just couldn't stop shanking the ball. And sure enough, after the first swing that he hit good, he started shanking. Right. And so then I was like, okay, your whole sequence is off your hands, come over the top in the downswing, they have no disassociation, all the stuff we talked about. And. But again, I had to figure out how do I get him to understand kinematic sequence without, you know, just explain it like a first grader, right? You're talking to a first grader. Sure enough, I was like, just throw that Frisbee left handed. And all of a sudden he's like, oh yeah, and shanks are gone. Right. Like he's just hitting the ball fine. But we had to start slow. [00:42:12] Speaker B: Amazing, right? [00:42:13] Speaker C: We couldn't just go crazy to 100. And I had to keep him under control. And again, I told him, you have to do work on your body, otherwise this stuff is just temporary. Your sequence can be great, but your body is still not cooperating. But he was great student. He's like, yeah, I get it, I understand. Thanks. And so he's going to do another one, you know, he'll come back in a month or whatever for progress report and see how things are going. But yeah, so you have to understand, you have. That's, that's where I still don't believe as good as AI is and everything, I still don't believe you can overcome the need for a person to converse with and make sure you understand concepts. You know what I mean? [00:42:47] Speaker A: Yeah. In, I think especially with golf, because how, at least in some elements of the golf swing, there's only so many ways you can do it correctly. You can't do it 17 different ways, but there are an infinite number of ways you can understand that and comprehend that. Right. And. And it takes somebody that you're really good at at that from my, you know, from stuff we've done together is just figuring out really quickly how to speak that person's language in a way that they can. And I'm sure for. I'm sure it takes time to figure out what that language is. Is it easier or harder? I guess I don't, I don't know if this is necessarily true of me, but I imagine that my kinematic sequence is pretty correct in terms of which muscles are firing in which order. I'm just not releasing that Tension at the right time. Is it easier to teach somebody that concept who is. No. If I have absolutely no concept of hips first, then body, then shoulders, then arms, then hands, let alone, you know, when to. Is it easier for you to teach the triggering process and the release process than it is someone like me who's got 30 years of doing it a certain way, or is it pretty even? [00:43:56] Speaker C: Either way, it all depends. Because sometimes people who've been doing it 30 years and have a lot of background knowledge are closed off to different ideas or closed off to doing things a different way, won't sling anything slower than 110%, you know, whatever. But, you know, but then I think people have to have good proprioception. We use that word over and over and over. But they do need to understand how to coordinate body movements. Because if you can't understand how to coordinate body movements, I can tell you to throw a Frisbee. And you still just all goes at one time. Right. So there has to be the ability to understand how different segments work and how to sequence them properly. Yes, there's a bazillion drills and ideas and concepts we can do, but then the student has to internalize it and understand it for their own. But, yeah, no, I don't know. It's. [00:44:36] Speaker A: It's. [00:44:37] Speaker C: I think people who never played any sports or never did any form of real athletic, just movement in general, didn't play as kids. They have the hardest time and they get frustrated. Especially if they're an older adult. They're frustrated because they want to get good at this thing fast. All their buddies have been playing for 10 years and they shoot in the 80s and they just came picked up the game. They've been successful in their career, successful in life, successful in whatever. And then they pick up this stick in this ball game and they're like, why can't I do this? And it's like, well, because you just chose to do the most challenging athletic movement there probably is for a lot of people, you know, with no athletic background whatsoever. [00:45:14] Speaker A: When I'm doing a bench press, for example, or a pushup, your max effort isn't at the very top of the press. It's probably going to be somewhere around 90. You know, when your arms. 90 degrees ish. Right. And in a squat, same type of thing, it's not the last two or three inches of a squat that's hard. It's about halfway through the squat that's really hard. [00:45:35] Speaker C: So, yeah, that's where you're at the biggest mechanical disadvantage when you get all the way to lockout, you've got a good mechanical advantage, right? It's when you're down at the bottom getting out of the hole, as we used to call it in the powerlifting. [00:45:47] Speaker A: All right, so if I'm thinking about this in terms of my golf swing for ever, how many years I have, I guess, been trying to reach that max effort point to where I've been basically trying to get it to a point where I'm, like, fully extended right at impact, or I'm trying. I don't know exactly what my timing would. How I would say that, but for me, I probably felt at some point or another, I saw that I was letting my lag angles go, and I thought that that meant that I needed to rotate more to hold the lag angles more. So I was. I'm. I do remember not even that long ago, like this year, looking at my swing and thinking, I really wish they would clock my clubhead speed at, you know, four feet before the ball, because I bet I'm swinging the club faster back there than I am at the bottom because I'm releasing all my. I would now go back and say, I think that's the opposite. I think I might have more clubhead speed four feet past the ball than what I have at impact. I'm. I'm trying to accelerate too far past. So all that to say, Tony, if there was a point in time. I don't know how to describe this, but whatever that feeling is, that when you're 90 degrees at A. On a bench press or at that most pivotal, you know, mechanical disadvantage. Everybody say it. At what point in your golf swing do you feel that you've got the most load, like, the most effort? That's when you're still going at your. Because to me, that's impact. Impact is where I'm trying to. In a text on one of Mike's unfiltered Fridays, I asked some question, and he. You said something about it. Impact. Your entire body is lit up red. Right? But is it at impact that you're putting in the most effort, or is it. If not, like, what point do you feel like that's when you're feeling the strain the most? [00:47:25] Speaker C: Well, let me just go back to your whole, like, speed real quick and, like, where the fastest. The point the club is moving the fastest. Right. Okay. There's a really good, simple experiment for people to do is just get an alignment stick. You know, something that when you swing it, you can hear the whoosh or, you know, something that's going to make a nice through the impact. If you just hold it as long as possible and turn as fast as you can all the way through the shot. The whoosh is not going to happen until it actually lets out, which is not going to be way until your hands are like way out past your body. Okay. And what it, what is, what do they say the fastest point of swing needs to be just at the bar slightly after the ball. Right. Well, you can't do that if you're still turning, turning, turning, turning, turning. It won't whoosh until way the heck out there. Right. So that's a good like just little experiment for people to do. Again, like I've told you before, I think you load it up and coil it and then shift and let it out. So I don't think that you necessarily have to be putting much more energy in. It's more about the coiling and then the shifting and letting it out. Like, I'd be very cautious to tell people to put where you putting the most energy in. Because if I said the point of biggest stretch, which is where the most potential energy is, is at the top of the backswing, then people are just going to go ah. As soon as they can't get to the top of the backswing as hard as they can because they're putting energy into system at that point versus storing energy and then letting it out. Make sense? [00:48:46] Speaker A: Yeah. I think that is maybe the way I was asking that question. It would be a tough one to answer. And it's funny because to me I'm thinking, okay, I think that the correct answer to that would be somewhere around arm, you know, parallel left arm parallel on the way back down. But that's not what I've experienced in real life. Because in real life when you unwind the swing almost in reverse. If everything from arm parallel on the way down to impact is basically deceleration, arm parallel on the way down, rewound back to arm parallel on the way back is not at that point is a. I'm slowing down also because I'm in transition. So really for me, if I'm trying to, if I'm having a speed day or it's a 520 yard par 5 or whatever, and I'm trying to get on one where I'm finding at least the most successful efforts to get more speed is just at a faster takeaway. Really to me, by the time the club's parallel or by the time I left arms parallel on the way back, I've. If I haven't created speed by that point, you just didn't hit it that far. I'm sorry, I can't do anything about it from that point. [00:49:51] Speaker C: Yeah, you can look at it. Yeah, you can look at it almost as like the speed is a reaction to an intention. [00:49:57] Speaker A: That's it. [00:49:58] Speaker C: Yeah, you see what I'm saying? [00:49:59] Speaker A: Because you're low. What you do in that first, what you do in the first third of the swing sets up how much recoil you're going to have at the top. And that's going to set up how much potential energy you have on the way back down. But if you take it back at, you know, five miles an hour, there's not a whole heck of a lot you can do from here back down to create energy if you hadn't already done it. [00:50:20] Speaker C: And that's why you're gonna go, you're gonna try to generate speed. Cause you didn't build it up to the start. Your intention wasn't there. So the guy I got to play golf with, he's like a social media guy. Jesus of golf. Who is. He got like third in the world Long Drive competition a year or two ago or something like that. But he has a video where he, he was at. I think he's at Dogwood, which is where one of our alumni, his facility is. But he was showing his progression, working up from like his stock 190 game speed up to like a 220, 20 mile an hour ball speed. And he goes, just watch my feet and watch how I build up pressure. He's like, watch, watch my intention with my feet. Bryson does it. Kyle Berkshire does it. All these big hitters do it, right? You see what I'm saying? [00:51:00] Speaker A: Tony Rosselli does it. [00:51:01] Speaker C: Tony Roselli does it. I'm not a big hitter anymore. Oh man, it was so funny. So on the way back, one of our, our best, you know, kind of our best player and he used to hit the ball a long way. He still hits it plenty. Ball speeds like 180 now, but he used to have 190. He's like, man, you know, I just, it's so sad that I can't hit 190 when I want now. And I just looked at him, I was like, do you know who you're talking to right now? Like you're talking to someone what, 21 years older than you or 20 years old and you talk about, man, I just wish I could do what I used to could do last year. I'm like, I don't want to Hear it? I do not want to hear it. But anyway, yeah, no, so. So, yeah, it's. It's the intention. It's again, look at the power lifters before they get into the. Into the squat box, right? They're getting smelling sauce and they're getting slapped across the face in the back. They're just, like, pumping up, they're charging up. The intention is I'm about to move some stuff. You know, they're not walking in like, oh, gee, I sure hope I can lift this. You know, Ronnie Coleman screaming lightweight. You know, just getting pumped. You know, Bryson, he's sitting there, he's, you know, getting this. He's getting all amped up. It's a response to an intention, and I think so. [00:52:08] Speaker A: All right, so. So let's go with that for a second. You're all amped up, and I'm going to move some stuff, and I'm, you know, I got that, you know, alpha male thing going, and I'm like, ready to. What part of the golf swing are you putting that energy into? Because to me, if I'm, If. If I've tried it all kinds of different ways, when I try to put that into the downswing, I hit it all over the world. And it's not that. [00:52:27] Speaker C: Because you have no release. Yes, correct. [00:52:30] Speaker A: When I try to put that into the transition, God help me, it gets bad. When I put that into my takeaway, the. I'll tell you, there was something when I was young, I was, like, probably 15, 16 years old when I heard this, but to this day, maybe the best golfer I've ever known. I played with some good ones, but this guy, he shot a 59. He was a plus 6, plus 7. He hit the ball 300 yards. When hitting the ball 300 yards was still a long way back in, like, the late 90s. [00:52:55] Speaker C: It's still a long way. It's still a long way. [00:52:57] Speaker A: It's still a long way. It really is. But he said one time, by the time you get the club to about parallel to the ground on the way back, the golf swings over. And I thought that was the craziest sounding thing. I. It's taken me 25 years to understand what the hell he was talking about, because I'm like, what do you mean? That's the. That from. That's barely even gotten started. There's all kinds of things you can do from there. But now I kind of understand that concept because if I'm swinging it well, all of my energy is in proper setup. 95% of my thought process goes into proper setup. The next 5% goes into the takeaway, and then from there, I'm just along for the ride. Right now, I'm not feeling that very much. I'm doing a lot of guiding at every other position in the golf swing, and I'm hitting it like absolute crap. But when I'm playing well, it's getting the proper setup and have a good start. And then from that point, everything else is just dominoes falling. [00:53:54] Speaker C: But, yeah, no, that's. Yeah, you know, you set it up properly and then just give it a. Give it a little intention, a little. A little stimulus to go, and that's about it, you know, like, your preparation is done. The intended shot is there. That gives the brain the pathway that you intend to send the body down. And then it goes. [00:54:11] Speaker A: Do you. Do you follow that when you're playing golf? Like, does. How much of your energy and thought process goes into the downswing versus the transition versus the what? Like, do you. Are you the same way kind of, that most of it happens early, and everything else is reaction? [00:54:25] Speaker C: You see what happens? Yep. As I think about throwing a ball, you know, like a quarterback and a wide receiver, the wide receiver and the quarterback both understand the route that's intended to be run. The quarterback sees what's happening, predicts that the receiver is going to be open, sees the spot they want to throw to. But all of that is happening up here, and it sends the signal out to the body that does the body what to do. There is no. At the last minute, the quarterback's thinking, oh, I should probably snap my wrist a little bit or something like that. Right. You know, it's like, nope, I see the play developing. I intend to throw it there. And then the ball is out. That's where, like, Dave Stockton and all these others with the unconscious putting stuff, they're like, you know, do you think about. When you. When you draw your signature, do you think about how to use your hand to draw the signature? Like, he has a. He has a thing he does with everybody he works with. He goes, okay, write your name. Sign your signature. He goes, okay, And I want you to think about copying that and try to do it slowly and figure out exactly how to make it the same. And it never looks good. It never looks the same because they're like, well, this is just something I know how to do. I just do it right. So he talks about putting as like your own signature. Everybody has their own signature the way they do it. So he's less technique oriented in that respect. But I just think it's, you know, think of the golf swing or that that whole energy. Intention is like, just write your signature. I need to go bigger. Okay. So I put more energy in, and it's out. I need less energy. It's a smaller shot. Boom. You know, whatever is a good drill. [00:55:47] Speaker A: For this, Tony, because sometimes I want to ask you, like, what's a good drill for this? And then you answer me with a drill that you've already told me, like, six months ago, which is really embarrassing and, you know, kind of sad. It's a good drill for this. Just the. [00:56:04] Speaker C: You like that sitting now you're like. You're like. You're like my college students who I just sit there in class and be like, okay, remember, by Sunday, you need to have turned in a, B, C, D, whatever. And then the student raises their hand. What do we got do this weekend? And everyone just looks at them. They just look at them. And I look at my class. I'm like, do y' all want to tell them, or should I embarrass him? You know, like, bro, he just said that 30 seconds ago. [00:56:30] Speaker A: But if I'm sitting here thinking about. I really want to ask you, like, what's a good drill to help me figure out the. This sequencing thing and to fit. Because I. I do have to figure out how to decelerate at the right time or whatever you want to call it. But to me, it sounds like this might be one of those where the walking and hitting golf balls drill might work, or the one that we were talking about at Solies that day, where it was just kind of shifting your weight back and forth and walking into the shot. That, to me, sounds like. I really want to say that sounds like the dumbest thing ever. That that would actually help, But I also think that it probably is. It's more of a. It's creating an athletic movement, not thinking about exactly at this moment in time. Start to pump the brakes 75% and then have it down to 25. Like, that's how I've thought about it for so long, and that's why I've sucked for so long. [00:57:15] Speaker C: But, yeah, that's a good one. [00:57:16] Speaker A: I'm serious. [00:57:16] Speaker C: That's a good one. And off speed, smaller swings would be good for you. You know, smaller. Gosh, I want to get up so bad. Can I please get up? Can I just stand up real quick and show you something? [00:57:26] Speaker A: If you'll move your camera so we can see you. You can do anything you want as long as I can see you. All right, so I have a problem with you going off camera. I don't care where the point. Where the camera's point. Okay? [00:57:34] Speaker C: So again, small swings. We're basically. We're half size and just maintain this position and hold your balance and just understand how much energy you've intended to put in. Is it out go faster, you know, from there to there, you know, but we're not. I'm not going add energy here and then hold it back this way. You know, it's just. What? It's just. It's bigging. It's just building up. Okay, small one. It all matches. You said more energy, right? But it's all matching, it's all sequenced, but less than full shots. So your brain can have a different impetus so that you actually have to engage your brain to have a starting and a stopping point, a size and energy level. Because if you just say full, your brain's really good at full. Okay, but it's not learning anything new. It's not training anything. It's just doing what you've done a bazillion times. You're not learning what you're trying to do. [00:58:27] Speaker A: Did you just give me permission and instruction to see how far and how much club head speed I can generate with a half lob widow? That's what I heard, Tony. Isn't that what you heard? How far can I hit a half lob wedge? [00:58:40] Speaker B: He was maybe implying that, right? [00:58:42] Speaker C: No, not at all. [00:58:44] Speaker A: But it wasn't just when you. Seriously, though, when it's not just hit half shots. You. You said hit half shots at different speeds. So a half shot maybe with a 20. Okay, so I didn't think. I don't think I caught that part of it before with. Because I'm just saying, okay, half shots, three quarter shots, full shots, and then really full shots where I swing fast full. But you're saying the. The length of the backswing versus the downswing or the follow through at a slow pace, mid pace, fast pace, and. [00:59:14] Speaker C: Then working like 30 shots where the lob wedge doesn't go farther than 20 yards, but you're doing it like slow so you can practice your sequence. Right? So like, hit a lob. [00:59:25] Speaker A: It's hard for me, man. I get the ball pretty far. It's hard. [00:59:27] Speaker C: I know. Hit a lob wedge, hit a lob wedge, where this is like the speed you're moving, but you go step coil out and just touch the ball. Step coil. [00:59:38] Speaker A: So how slow is. How slow is too slow as you move up like, a 20 yard shot is easy for me because that's a touch shot around the greens. But if I'm taking a half swing, you know, my. My arm parallel to arm parallel lob wedge is about 65 yards. How short should I be trying to hit that when I'm on the slow end of that? I mean, like, do I need to try to take a full swing and hit it 40 yards, or is it just like. [01:00:01] Speaker C: Go back and watch. There's a video of Ben Hogan after he was retired and older in age, where he's on the beach with some friends and he does his entire golf swing in super slow motion, right? The whole thing in super slow motion. That gives his brain. And when we do things in slow motion, it gives our brain time to process what our intention is. I want to load it, shift it, hold that coil for just a little bit, and then it's out, right? That gives you the space to really dial in your brain and figure out the feeling of all that. So, yeah, take a bigger swing, a size swing, but do it slow and just touch the ball. I know that's such a weird concept for you. Like, what do you mean? Not touch the ball. Hit the ball. Hit the ball. I want to hit the ball. No, like, just. [01:00:41] Speaker A: That's insane. [01:00:42] Speaker C: Touch the ball just so that you can get the sequencing right and you can feel it. Then your brain can slowly build up speed, slowly build up energy, slowly build up. It's no different than what Mike's telling you with. Start off with these small exercises. You can build the foundation, and then you can build up to doing the sexy exercises or whatever, right? [01:01:03] Speaker A: Yeah, Mike, Yeah. It's the. The stretching stuff. I've been blown away with that. And I'm. I'm going back through. I mean, I've only released two videos from our gym session last time. It's funny that the second one we released was on the. The core muscles, and again, same type of thing. I had been really struggling getting out of s posture and getting, you know, not getting my back so. So arched. I was like, oh, yeah. Mike said. Mike told me how to do this. So I've been doing planks lately to try. And I'm sitting here thinking about it. It's like I always thought of gym time. It's like I got to go in and lift a lot of weight and sweat a lot. I think I've got enough drills from you that I could spend an hour a day just doing mobility exercises. That would do more good for me than an hour in the Gym and I didn't break a sweat. But I'm trying to incorporate more and more of that stuff into just, you know, day to day life and just find it's, it's funny because I'm not really. I don't feel like I've worked out in a long time, but the foam rolling and stuff that I did for the last couple weeks and the stretching and all that stuff, I feel like did more good for me for the, for the golf swing at least than maybe a year in the gym of doing squats and power cleans and all that crap I was doing a few years ago before I, when we were working together. So it's. Yeah, working, working smarter, not harder, in a way, I guess. [01:02:25] Speaker B: Yeah, TPI talks about like in the weight room, trying to create more complexity in the weight room. So it's different than training for some other sports. They've done studies about, you know, just getting the athlete, the golfer stronger, just improving their bench, their squats, their pull. They didn't find a correlation with better golf. And what they found was the more complicated we could take a movement, like the more complicated we could make a push by adding some balance, by adding some rotation or just, just whatever. And the cool thing is it's like they just leave it up to us, you know, like, just how creative can you be and make the movement more complex. How can you make a pull more complex? How can you make a push? How can you make a squat? Some of my clients call them circus tricks. They're like, I feel like I'm at the circus. I'm like spinning a plate with one hand and then I'm like, shake waiting with the other hand. And I know I work with other people that don't necessarily work with golfers, and sometimes they're probably like, what in the heck is he doing over there? But it's just cool that some science, there's some study behind it. And they're like, yeah, actually, actually can help the golfer. And so, yeah, to your point, Gary, just like, if you're just going in there trying to, you know, bench press heavier, I mean, that all has its place, right? Maybe in the off season, maybe do a little bit more heavy lifting. But yeah, that's the tough thing for me is how can I. Because I, most of the time I have my clients for 30 minutes, 45 minutes or an hour. So how can I incorporate some soft tissue, some stretching, some mobility, some corrective exercises and strength training in an hour? And it's, it's a balancing act for Me there, there's not, there's not just one way to do it, right. And so it's, it's a balancing act for me and it's constantly changing based on how that person is doing. What I'm finding right now in the gym, where, you know, right now we're mid November and I'm just finding a lot of people are coming to the gym tired. We've, we've had daylight savings now. And I'm, golly, I cannot tell you guys. Doesn't matter what time of day. It doesn't matter if it's 6am or somebody sliding in at 11am they're like, I am just tired. And so that is for me to push somebody super, super hard I think would be counterproductive. And so it's like, how do I do the mental gymnastics of, okay, how do I work this person out and get. And make it a beneficial time for them, but knowing that they're tired and it just allergies, allergy season, people react differently to that. So anyway, it's, it's constantly evolving and changing depending on how the client client is coming in for that day. [01:05:30] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:05:30] Speaker C: I have one more thing to Mike's point. Brute force does not a golfer make. Right? Brute force does not equate to skilled golfers. And again, if you look at different sports and even within sports, different positions, what an offensive lineman needs to be elite and have the best chance for their desired position, what the outcomes of their position is, is very different than what the free safety or the running back, like sprinters versus hurdlers versus long jumpers versus basketball, like, it all looks different. And there's a reason why all these golfers typically fall within this like, mold, you know, and if you watch what they do in the tent before the PGA Tour events, it's a lot of these cross body, push, pull, explosive movements, kettlebell swings, core work, stability work, balance ball works. Right? So as to Mike's point, right, like, just because you're strong doesn't mean you're gonna be a good golfer. And you shouldn't just necessarily focus just on brute force, whether it's swing speed or whether it's weightlifting, you know, so it's, it's definitely. We need to practice and train for the sport we're trying to compete in. And that means that the weight lifting, all the other stuff is going to look slightly different probably. [01:06:37] Speaker A: This is literally something that I like. I loved working out with you, Mike, back in the day a few years ago. I loved our sessions together. This is literally Just a thought I had five seconds ago or 10 seconds ago as we were talking here. I think when I look back to that time, I kind of looked at it and said, okay, if I'm getting better physically, most of that is coming from the three days a week that I'm going to the gym and I'm doing power cleans and squats and doing all these things that I think I'm supposed to be doing. And then Mike's a nice little bonus thing. But at the end of the day, like, how important is it to be able to do shoulder presses while I rub my belly button or whatever the hell we were doing? It felt like it was really funky stuff and, and yeah, it was really, you know, I could see how it was golf related. But working out with you almost, and I've told you this before, it felt almost like a, a little bit of a, A golf lesson in a gym, like it was still working on. And I liked that because it was incorporating some of the things that I was working on my golf swing into like, workout stuff. But I didn't feel like it was really making my body any better. It just felt like it was something that was making. It was. It was just a different way to, to, to train myself. I was in a golf club. Fast forward now. Seven years or whatever it's been. I'm blown away at how much. Just 15, 20 minutes of working on my body in the right way makes me better equipped to play my sport, as Tony was saying. Right. I'm not. Who, who gives a how much I can power clean. Power cleans don't matter with a golf club. Right? Mike, you made the point the other day in that video. Like, I'm gonna have you hold a plank for 20 seconds. How long do you have to do it in a golf swing? One second. It doesn't matter if I can hold a plank with a 30 pound weight on my back for 45 seconds. You don't have to do that in a golf swing. Right? But the stuff you do with tpi, it's incredible how big of an impact it can make to your. On your ability to swing the club correctly. And I don't think I. Again, wasn't thinking about this two minutes ago, but I don't think I appreciated that enough back in the day. Like, I'm starting to get it now, but man, the. There is something to being able to jump rope while you chew bubble gum and try to see if you can do it in circles to gain some of that mobility, I guess. But it's cool stuff, so thanks, brother. [01:08:46] Speaker B: Appreciate it. [01:08:46] Speaker A: And, Tony, thank you. I appreciate both you guys. [01:08:49] Speaker C: I. [01:08:49] Speaker A: We joked on the very first podcast that I was just here for free golf lessons, but I really am getting a ton out of the conversation, the videos and stuff that we're doing. So I. I do appreciate the free lessons and the free tips, and one of these days, I'm gonna start listening to it and might actually get a little better. [01:09:04] Speaker C: But Masters, watch out. Garrett Layles on the first tee on the way. [01:09:08] Speaker A: Yeah, it'll be the Sully's Masters crossover event, but I will be there. [01:09:13] Speaker C: Yeah. [01:09:14] Speaker A: Oh, Tony, have you. Did you play Tahoe Farm? [01:09:17] Speaker C: That's. This is coming up Friday next week. [01:09:19] Speaker A: Okay, we'll get to that. [01:09:20] Speaker C: And one of the guys I'm playing with is. He texted me today. I just got to the part where Garrett's talking about Tothill Farm. This is hilarious. I was like, yeah, we'll see. [01:09:29] Speaker A: It's awful. [01:09:30] Speaker C: It's awful. [01:09:30] Speaker A: I absolutely hate it. [01:09:31] Speaker C: My students told me it's great. [01:09:32] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:09:33] Speaker C: I think it's just you. [01:09:34] Speaker A: When. When you get there, just give it a middle finger for me on your way into the parking lot. That's. [01:09:39] Speaker C: Well, they also told me, they said, don't go playing expecting to shoot a score. Go play a fun golf course. And they're like, they have a different definition of fun than you do, huh? [01:09:51] Speaker A: Yes, you can go expecting to experience a golf course, that's for sure. I don't know about a fun one, but it will be an experience. [01:09:58] Speaker C: This show will not be sponsored by Tothill Farm anytime soon, that's for sure. [01:10:02] Speaker A: Ever. Ever. I would not accept a sponsorship. [01:10:10] Speaker C: Wow. [01:10:11] Speaker A: I'm just kidding. Tahille Farm, if you want to sponsor. [01:10:13] Speaker C: An episode, free or heavily discounted golf at those. Is that establishment. Don't. I do not speak for me. [01:10:22] Speaker A: We'll make up some best golf podcast ever. Flyers for you to leave in the clubhouse. [01:10:27] Speaker C: There you go. [01:10:27] Speaker A: While you're in there, Mike, were you gonna say something a minute ago? [01:10:31] Speaker B: Well, just two things from both you guys. So what Tony was saying about the Frisbee golf thing, that. That really resonated with me, and it makes me want to go try that concept because. Makes me think about the kinematic sequence and keep, you know, using my lower body. But anyway, that stuck out to me, and I'm interested to try that. And then also, you know, we've been talking about foam rolling so much, and it's funny because I think it's real. I get. I've gotten away from that. And I usually just foam roll about once a week. A lot of times I'm working out in between clients and so I'm just getting this habit of, of just jumping on the bike for 10 minutes. And I've been made it a point of emphasis. This week, instead of warming up for 10 minutes on the elliptical, I've been spending that 10 minutes foam rolling. And it's actually gotten me more loosened up for my workout. So I'm just. It's. The more we talk about stuff, it just, it resonates. It, you know, gets me to think about things. So. Iron sharpens iron. [01:11:33] Speaker A: Yeah. Foam rolling can be a frustrating one too, in a way because it's, it's very painful. Okay. Especially if you've not done it before. There are certain parts of it that it hurts like crazy. It hurts as much as anything else that you could do in the gym, but it doesn't feel that. It doesn't feel like a productive burn. Right. Like when your muscles are worn out after doing a 150 curls or whatever, you feel like you've done something, but that kind of pain doesn't feel like you've, you've accomplished much. But once it starts to kick in and you feel like you can move around a little bit, it's you really. I mean, I feel so much more, I hate to say athletic, but it really is the right word. I feel so much more comfortable over the golf ball now and having an ability to move, just loosening some things up a little bit. So, yeah, I think it's one of the most things, one of the coolest things a golfer can do that they probably haven't done before, haven't tried before. So shout out to foam rolling, as Mike would say. [01:12:24] Speaker C: And honestly, it just, I'll say the more I'm listening to Garrett and all of his, like, excessive, like 150 curls, the more I'm thinking another like, website like Urban Dictionary, if you look like doing too much, you just see a picture of Garrett. It's like this is doing too much. [01:12:41] Speaker A: I've never done 150 curls in my life. [01:12:43] Speaker C: Beer curls. [01:12:44] Speaker A: But I do tend to exaggerate the beer curl. [01:12:47] Speaker C: Right. [01:12:47] Speaker A: That I may have done a few times. Yeah, I've even cut back on the, on the beer count trying to, trying to lose, lose some weight to be able to move. I'm, I'm, I'm committed, guys. I'm telling you, I'm finally going to start doing the stuff we say to do on this podcast. [01:12:59] Speaker C: Watch out. [01:13:00] Speaker A: See what happens. In fact, I even made it. I told you, Tony, I am 100. I'm 100% committed to the wedge ladder and doing that every single day. And I did. I followed that for a whole one day before I went back to, you know, mechanic stuff. [01:13:17] Speaker C: Well, we tried. [01:13:17] Speaker A: We'll get back on that tomorrow maybe. [01:13:21] Speaker C: We tried. [01:13:22] Speaker A: All right, guys, enjoy. Oh, by the way, if you're listening, watching, whatever, go check us out on YouTube. Mike and Tony have some really cool stuff on there. So I've been sitting. I've been sitting here for. Hyping these guys up for an hour, but go check out the YouTube channel. YouTube. [01:13:36] Speaker C: @. [01:13:36] Speaker A: Best Golf Podcast ever. And you could see these guys in action and. And listen to what they say. They know what they're talking about. [01:13:42] Speaker C: You can see Gary Elvis live in action. [01:13:47] Speaker A: Yes, sir. All right, that's enough. See y'. [01:13:51] Speaker C: All. [01:13:51] Speaker B: Bye. [01:13:56] Speaker C: There I go, getting up again. [01:14:00] Speaker B: Yeah, that was a word I'm not sure if I'm familiar with. [01:14:04] Speaker C: Okay, the golf club. I don't know what day it is. You'd spend three days with college students and nobody out of state. Not in your own bed. You don't know what day it is. Anyway, hence. Hence again. Right. [01:14:24] Speaker A: Bottom.